Ayu Adiati - Working through burnout as a self-taught developer

Season 3, Episode 3 | July 19, 2021

In this episode, Dan and Bekah talk to Ayu about the impact of community, being a prolific blogger, and the very real challenge of burnout.


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Ayu Adiati

Originally from Indonesia and now based in The Netherlands, Ayu Adiati is a self-taught Frontend Developer & Technical Blogger. She’s on her way to break into tech from being a stay-at-home-mom of now a 4 years old daughter.

When Ayu is not coding, you can find her with the DLSR camera on her hands, cuddling with her daughter, or enjoying her iced macchiato latte.

Show Notes:

In this episode, Dan and Bekah talk to Ayu about the impact of community, being a prolific blogger, and the very real challenge of burnout. Ayu's openness about the challenges of being a mom on the self-taught track into tech, isolation, and fears of not being good enough are the stories that we don't share enough of. Because when we share, we can all work through them together. Thank you, Ayu, for reminding us that it's ok to not be ok.

Links mentioned in the episode:

Virtual Coffee:

Transcript:

Bekah:

Hello, and welcome to season three, episode three of the Virtual Coffee podcast. I'm Bekah. And this is a podcast that features members of the Virtual Coffee community. Virtual Coffee is an intimate group of developers at all stages of their coding journey. And they're here on this podcast, sharing their stories and what they've learned. And we're here to share it with you. Here with me today is my cohost, Dan.

Dan:

Thanks Bekah. Today, we're talking with Ayu Adiati. Ayu's originally from Indonesia and now based in the Netherlands. She's a self-taught front end developer and prolific technical blogger. And she's on her way to break into tech after being a stay at home mom for her daughter for the past four years. We talked with Ayu about the impact of community, being a blogger while she's learning web development and her recent experiences with burnout.

Bekah:

We start every episode of the podcast like we start every Virtual Coffee. We introduce ourselves with our name, where we're from, what we do and a random check-in question. Today's random question is: "If you could teleport to anywhere for 15 minutes, where would you go?" We hope you enjoy this episode. Hey, I'm Bekah. I am a front end developer from a small town in Ohio and I could teleport to anywhere for 15 minutes. I don't, I like, I can't decide if I want like a nice, beautiful location or if I want like really good food. I, well, I don't know. I don't have a really good specific place, but I would go somewhere that has a beautiful location that has good food and drink. So my answer.

Dan:

I, uh, man, that just made me start thinking like, okay, well now I need to know the rules. Can you take things with you when you teleport back?

Bekah:

You can do whatever you want.

Dan:

Okay.

Bekah:

It's your

Dan:

Um, I mean, it just changed my whole. Alright. Hi. Um, hi, I'm Dan. I am from Lakewood, Ohio. Do front end development if I could. So I was going to say something. Uh, somewhere, maybe like the top of Mount Everest or somewhere where it's generally like, not great to be, or the it's really hard to get to, you know, but it would be cool to just like be there for 15 minutes, kind of see everything, whatever. And by the time 15 minutes are up, um, you know, oxygen deprivation is probably setting in I'm pretty cold, so I'm ready to go home. Um, but you said food, which made me think, okay, well, You know, can you take things with you and in, so maybe my answer is more like, you know, Fort Knox

Bekah:

bank.

Dan:

and also have a bank, right. Uh, somewhere else, you know, other secret, and now I'm thinking, oh, maybe there's like, uh, like that secret room in the library of Congress that was in, um, you know, one of the national treasure books, you know, or may national treasure movies, um, somewhere to like find a bunch of secrets or something, you know, anyway, um, I'm going to stick with my original answer officially as Mount Everest and, um, we'll we can move on from there.

Ayu:

Hi, I'm Ayu and I'm front end developer from, uh, Indonesia or originally, but, uh, base in Netherlands now. And if I can teleport myself or 15 minutes, I would split it into two. I would visit the, my sister in Australia and my brother in New Zealand. That would be nice because we haven't seen each other for almost three years now.

Dan:

Oh, wow.

Bekah:

Wow.

Dan:

Yeah, well, that's, that's a good answer. I live too close to all of my family, so

Bekah:

My brother lives down the street a little bit, literally have run to my parents' house and to my other brother's house. So

Ayu:

That's

Bekah:

not that

Dan:

no, it's, it's nice. I w we do it on purpose, but you know, it's fine. I could take 15 minutes and probably get away from them.

Bekah:

Yeah, I like the take up splitting that's. That was good.

Dan:

Yeah. Yeah. There's

Bekah:

Welcome. We are very happy to have you here with us and for everyone who is listening, just want to say a special thank you to Ayu because she's doing this super late. Um, so we can make sure that the time zones, um, mashed up and we could get her on here. So we are very, very happy that this works.

Ayu:

Thank you for having me.

Bekah:

Um, we always like to start with everyone's origin story, kind of how they got to this point where they're learning tech or in tech. So if you could just give us your background.

Ayu:

Well, I. Have a hobby as a photography and it was starting from my photography hobby. And I did the freelancer for stock photography. And then I have my daughter and then when she starts like one and half year, and it becomes like really fun because she start to, you know, uh, be aware of the camera. Yeah, it's it's from there. And then I thought it would be nice if I have like a blog or something, like to have this personal documentation. So I was like, browsing anything about WordPress or any blogging things, but then I bumped into frequent camp and then I just tried it. And from there, I just like it. Yeah. There's no going back from there. It's like, I want to know more and more and more. That's how I finally got into coding.

Bekah:

that. It's always so great to hear how people discover it, like through other things that they've enjoyed doing. And then it just kind of becomes something that you want to do more and more of. Um, so you said, you mentioned free code camp. Is that, um, how long did you stay in free code camp or are you still doing free code camp or, you know, what are the resources that you found really helpful?

Ayu:

I actually not, I mean, like for something that I learned for the first time, I'm more an audio visual person. So I like video more. And so a friend of mine, she was like, why don't you try Udemy? So I start with Udemy and. I like it. I mean, like when, when I see, you know, like I see, and then I, I code along with it then, uh, it's just. Um, but they still use free code camp to get the certifications. Like you don't have to finish all the modules. Right. And you can just jump into like, make all the projects that, uh, that are needed and, uh, finish, uh, uh, certification. I did the first certification, um, uh, web responsive this design, I think. Yeah, it was it. And yeah. I use, uh, more physio, uh, from YouTube or something like that. But after I understand something, then I can use the other resources, like a blog articles or something like that. Yeah. But for the first time it's always video.

Bekah:

I think that's great. And it's always interesting to hear the different approaches that people take, because I know for me, I can't watch the videos at first. I'm the opposite. So I need to read through it and then I can watch the video, like what is happening here. So it's, and that's just another reason why content creation in all forms can be so great because everybody learns differently and those different approaches, um, one works for me and one works for you and something. Different works for somebody else. And so it's great to be able to have that out there.

Ayu:

Yeah. True.

Bekah:

So Ayu, I think that I may have known you longer than anybody else at Virtual Coffee,

Ayu:

Yeah, I think so, too.

Bekah:

because I think I, I, I met you shortly after I started learning to code. I think we were both doing, we were both in the group, moms can code and that's how we met. And we were both learning to code with kids at home. And as we all know, that can be a challenge. Um, So, so what, what was it like for, what has it been like for you? Because you are also, self-taught, you're pursuing this, not in the confines of a bootcamp or in a traditional school setting and you have a kid at home too, so there's just a lot of different moving pieces there.

Ayu:

Yeah. I start to, uh, learn to code when she was, uh, my daughter was. Two years old and, uh, I was self-taught and then, uh, I think that I tweeted, I tweeted one time. How to juggling between the house chores and the kid, and also, uh, learning. And then I remember that one of, uh, who were response to my tweet was you back out, so yeah. And you said you join mom and then it's like, oh, there's a moment. Cool. That's nice. You know, so yeah. Yeah, I joined it, but yeah, with the time differences. I got more coworking with the European times on moms and we. Hmm, learning, uh, things that are different. One to another, like, uh, one is like doing in the back end and the other is the front end, but I mean, like that's for the first time that I felt like I'm not alone, you know, like, I don't care what they're doing, but it's like, I'm not, I'm not learning by myself. And I, we can have like all our, our kids. You know, my kids were crying and then they were like, Hey, stop it there or something like that. But yeah, it's, it's not easy. And, um, when she was two, my, um, the time for me to learn was only on her neck. And then I have to wait until the whole house is sleeping, like around them at night. And then I start learning from that until 12 one in the morning. And yeah, uh, it's getting easier now after she start with her elementary school, but it was like, hell before. It's like, I, I couldn't find any perfect time to learn and. Two hours in total for the whole learning. So, yeah. So I cannot imagine that you have four, Bekah, you still.

Bekah:

You know, it was one of those things. Where you start to get used to being able to pivot pretty quickly like, oh, my kids are playing, I'm going to sit down at this computer. And then my mind would just like switch on, like, it knew it has to do it right in this second. But, you know, I had a lot of help from my parents would watch the kids or if I had a project to do, I remember one weekend, my husband was out of town speaking at a conference. And so they took the kids and it was the same thing like you were talking about. You're just trying to. Fit in this time. And so I stayed up so late and then woke up the next morning to try and get it done. Cause you're trying to fit it in. But at the same time, you don't want to be formal. Bad self care habits, because then that just leads to frustration and not wanting to do the thing that you want to do. And then being mad that you don't want to do the thing that you know, you want to do. Right. Um, so it's all, it's a whole, I don't know, thing to juggle and it's not just about learning. It's about. You know, the growth and the changes that you're facing yourself. And it's a different role that you're taking on and trying to figure out how all these things work together. And so it can be really great, but certainly it can be really frustrating.

Ayu:

True. True. And especially that I don't have my family here. Right. And my husband works, so I have to do everything by myself. So yeah. It's like, and people said that, oh, you have like lots of time because you only stay at home. And, oh my God, I feel like I want to cry every time I hear that because no, if we can have like more than 24 hours in a day, that wouldn't be perfect, you know? But we don't

Bekah:

Yeah. I always say that's like my biggest challenge. There's not 36 hours in a day.

Ayu:

Yeah.

Dan:

I imagine it at least, knowing you, I, if you had 36 hours in a day, you would find a way to fill all of that. And still that's still what you wish there was more. Yeah, it's just a

Bekah:

accurate.

Dan:

Uh, Yeah, it's that, that switch off. I mean, we, my kids are in daycare, you know, my wife and I both work. But during the pandemic, you know, at the beginning, um, everything was shut down. Daycare was shut down, you know? And so we were trying to do that. We're trying to juggle the kids and work and, you know, uh, Emily, I would switch off, you know, watching the kids and, um, For me, that for me, I struggled really hard with that context. Switching like Bekah, you said you got, you got good at it. That was really very hard for me, you know? Like, um, and honestly it was less some, it wasn't that you sitting down at the computer part, it was the, the going back from computer to kids switch. That was the, that was a struggle for me. Um, you know, I, I just have so much respect for people who are parenting like full-time and trying to learn or work like through all this I, that I don't know how you do it, but it seems like you've been managing it.

Ayu:

I don't know. I still don't know how to do it Dan. I don't know.

Bekah:

it's the truth too. I mean, people will ask, like, how do you do it? I don't know, you know, you just do the things that you, you have to do.

Ayu:

Yeah, exactly.

Bekah:

We talked about these frustrations that can be that you're facing that we're all facing as we're learning these things and as we're parenting and going through a global pandemic together. And, and so I think. Sometimes, really leaning into the things that encourage us or inspire us can be really useful. Have there been things or people along the way that you found have helped you continue the journey or, um, prevented you from giving up and maybe some of those times that were really hard

Ayu:

Yeah. I mean, like, I got burned out like so many times. Right. And, and, um, well, I've been active on Twitter and that helps, uh, I'm doing the, um, A hundred codes of challenge. And, uh, um, every time I sit like, oh my God, I don't know what to do. And then some people like random people, like, no, you can do this. And yeah, I got, I get my spirit back and. There are also times, especially when you were a self-taught. Right. And you, you don't, you don't have anybody to talk with. Like my husband, he doesn't know anything about web dev, so I can not like, oh, I'm having trouble with this code. And he was like, what, what do you mean? Correct. So, yeah, I mean, uh, I got the one time burn out. Like that's pretty recently that I think. Okay. I don't think that this is for me and like, I'm going to, I'm going to just quit. And I was like, I got so, so surprise actually with, with that thoughts, because I never thought like, yeah, I got burnt out, but then like, uh, uh, you know, like I'm taking break and stuff and I would be fine again, but this time it's like different. I already took break. I mean, like I already procrastinated, but still. I don't know how to get myself together this time. Like, uh, I got panic attack. It was like, I learn. And then one time, like we were having this, uh, Uh, theme, right? I I'm trying with some VC members to have this, uh, group project about vanilla JavaScript. I mean, I got burned out with react with learning react before, and then I thought, oh, this is a good chance because it's funny, like JavaScript. So I can like take a step back and then do what I know, you know, but because so far I learned by myself doing everything by myself. When it's in a group, it's a different story, right? You have somebody else to collaborate and everybody has their own thoughts, like on how to approach something, which is not the approach that I probably would take, so it's kind of made me confused and then I got like so freaked out and I was like, What is happening, where are we in? I don't know. My God, this is funny, like JavaScript. And I've done this like so many times, but how come I'm not following this? You know, it's like, I cannot do it. And this feels like I want to stop. So I kind of pull myself a little bit off from everybody for like a week or so. But then I thought like, no, I need to talk to someone about this. Right. So I start to talk to some of my friends and they were all like, okay, we are all struggling. Like you can do this. And then like one of them even say to them, It's actually good that you, you have that thought of quitting because you don't understand things because if you have that thought, it means that, you know, so many things, so you get confused, you know, it's not like you don't know anything, like yeah, you're right. I was like, okay. And that's, you know, like people don't want to share they're struggling. Right. I don't know. Maybe because. Um, they don't want people to think they're weak or I don't know. They, they have their own reasons. As for me, I feel more or less embarrassed. Like I've been learning for so long and then suddenly, like, I know nothing, you know, and I don't, I just don't want to share that. If I really want to do this, I want to step forward. Then I think that I should share this struggle with at least, uh, somebody that can, that I know that can hear me out. Listen to me, you know? And it was a good decision that I made that I just, you know, share here are my struggles. And then people support me. I mean, like if you, if you don't share, nobody knows and you just have to deal it yourself. Yeah. It's, it's been a journey.

Dan:

Yeah.

Bekah:

Certainly a journey. You said some things in there that that really struck me. And so you talked about this idea of community and isolation and sharing, and I think that, you know, all of these things go together and especially when we're in those. Tough moments where we tend to isolate from other people, for those reasons that you spoke about, you know, it's self doubt and not thinking you can do it and being embarrassed or afraid to share things. And I got a piece of advice pretty early on from someone and they said, Um, you don't share it for your show yourself. You share for other people because other people who are going through the same things can recognize that, oh, I don't have to do this in isolation. I'm not the only one that feels this way. And then that's how community is formed. And I just always loved that idea because it can be so hard to share those things and to feel alone and to feel like. I dunno, you're you're not where you should be. Right. Like, I it's, it happens every week. I look at someone else and I'm like, oh wow. I, I should, I should be able to know what they're talking about. And I don't. Right. And then it's like, oh, don't fall into the comparison trap, number one. But number two, like embrace that community of people that's around you. And you know, for me, I you've been such a huge part of my community and I don't know how you do it, but I feel like. There are times when I am really, really struggling and I won't say anything. And then I get a DM from you checking on me and I'm like, oh, okay. Like I use here. This is what I needed, you know? And so for me, that's been such a, um, uh, an important piece of, of all of the things that have happened to me since I met you, because it's nice to have that connection. And to know that there are people that are, are, are willing to, to care about you.

Ayu:

And, and I learned so much from, from, uh, your trauma stories, spectrum, and like, you've been so open. Right. And, and you reach so many people with your story. And, and I mean, like, there are plenty of people there that. Have the same feeling like how you feel, but they cannot let it out. So I thought like when, when I was struggling, I thought like, okay, this is for, for me, for myself, you know, I mean, like, and, and, uh, I also think that maybe I'm not the only one, maybe, maybe there's also people out there that having the struggle the same as I do. And if I open up, maybe those people can open up as well and they, and they could like feel a little bit relieved that, okay. I'm not the only one. And I, I can, I can talk about it. Like it's, it's okay to not feel okay. You know, so yeah. I thank you so much because you taught me how to do that.

Bekah:

No, I'm going to cry.

Dan:

You, you talked about sharing, you know, your story, especially regarding the burnout and, you know, the we'll post on the, on the show notes, but you wrote a really great piece about it. Um, but two week, a couple weeks ago or a week ago, whatever it was. And, um, I, uh, I, I just wanted to call it out because I, I love to reading it. And I loved that. Uh, you know, you shared, you shared the struggle part, which is. I agree is very important and very helpful for people. Um, but I, I very much loved how you, um, a lot of the article is more about how to survive it, you know, how, how to sort of recognize those feelings for what they are and then how to sort of survive and move on. And, um, I just really appreciated it. I don't I don't have I don't really have a question or a point, but, but I appreciated it. I mean, you know, it, and a lot of it is just the, um, allowing yourself to. Be not okay. Or whatever, allow yourself to take a break or step back. Um, and I think it's so important. Um, it was, it was a good.

Ayu:

self care is really, really important. I mean, like, this is like one point in my, in my learning journey where I really, really want to rush things, you know, like, um, I've been learning for. Two years, two and half years now. And I feel like, why am I so slow? So I'm trying to, you know, speed up a bit. But I think like, because I start to understand things, so I really want to speed up again, speed up again. But I didn't, I, you can say that I ignore my. Well, I should take a break, but I don't because no, I want to be in this momentum, you know, like I, I want to keep it up, but now this is my limit to take a break for a bit, but I didn't. So I think that's where most people also don't aware where they really want to push and push and push forward. Um, they need to, you know, like take a step back and just refute the center's slowing down a bit, then they don't think about themselves, you know, like, like, um, they can get burnout or can get frustration. So, yeah. My experience skin, like reminding people as well, that the, they need to, you know, take a step back once in a while.

Dan:

Yeah, it's hard to do or it can be, you know, it can't be hard to do. Um, at least in my personal experience.

Bekah:

Well, and I think too, when you take that step back, sometimes it's hard to get started again. Right? There's this fear of losing momentum, like, well, I was there and you have to backtrack a little bit if you take a break. And so for a lot of people, I think it's, I don't know. Exactly how to describe that feeling, whether it's being upset with themselves or having to go back or getting, being hard on yourself and thinking like, well, I should know this stuff. Right. But it's okay to have to backtrack. It's okay. To start from a different point that you ended up. But I think, like you're saying, there's just not that many people that are talking about those things, you know, it is okay to take a break. It is okay to be at a different point than someone else's going to be. And I don't know this is going to sound silly, but I always used to compare myself to Kent C Dodds, which is like, not fair in any way, shape or form. Cause he's been doing this a long time, but I'm like, he's got four kids. How come he can do all this stuff. Right? Like what. It's a little bit different. He actually, he wrote a newsletter for mother's day, one year. I think that talked about how much his wife does to support him and their kids. And it was like, oh, okay. I get, I get this right? Like there's a lot of support for the things that he's doing and he's been doing it a really long time. And it's. A reasonable comparison. I'm not really that reasonable, so it's not surprising that I would do that. But, um, it's not even like, look at the people who are learning alongside you. It should never, if that's the motivation, then there's always going to be a point where you start to really get down on yourself because everybody moves in different ways and in different paces. And you know, sometimes you'll hit a plateau. And it'll be really hard to get back up like the mountain. Um, but then, but then you'll gain some momentum and then you'll go fast again. Right. You know, maybe your, your study all the time, everybody learns differently. Everybody, um, can apply things in different ways and has different strengths. And I think we just failed to recognize that complexity and we try and make it this really simple story of success. And we forget all of the, you know, things about being human that go along with that story.

Ayu:

Yeah, true. And I kind of forget that. I mean, like I was thinking I'm learning for two, two and a half years and, uh, I'm, I'm going so slow, but I forgot that. Most of the days, I only have two until three hours a day to learn. Right. So I cannot compare myself to someone who can spend like more than five hours a day to learn. So, um, yeah, I need to remind myself that

Dan:

Okay.

Ayu:

You're, you're going forward. Only that you have like less time than other people. So you cannot compare yourself to other people, but this is your time. Right? I mean, I do, uh, the best way. I mean, like the best that I could within two and three hours a day, and that's actually good, you know, like when I got exhausted, I still can, um, save some time to learn. So I think. Uh, I've been too hard on myself or something like that and not appreciate myself. I don't know. But yeah, I'm trying to remind me myself about that. Like You're, you're doing good. You're you're doing okay. You know, so.

Dan:

Yeah, I, I mean, you are, you're doing great. I can't, uh, trying to fit that learning and, and it's not just the hours, right. Is you've talked. You were talking about how it's like a little bit during nap time and then late at night. Um,

Ayu:

Yeah,

Dan:

Which probably not the best, you know, your brain's probably not in the best shape for learning at that point either. Right. And so that's what I mean here. You know, you're, you're, you're working with what you have. Um, and the progress you've made seems I don't know what to say from where I'm sitting. It seems incredible. Um, you've also been just a prolific blogger, like over the last, however long, a couple of years. Uh, and I've always been, I mean, like that. Yeah. I don't know, I've read. I think probably most of everything you've written, but like it's, it's, uh, very impressive. I was wondering how you approach, like mixing that into your normal routine of like learning and stuff like that.

Ayu:

No blogging is, is completely different thing. I mean, like I really have to, uh, make a time to write a blog and English is not my native, right. So I'm not native English speakers. So, I mean, I need like three to four hours to arrive. 600 to 800 words. And you imagine so. Yeah, mostly like when I do blogging, um, if I have an idea, I will do the bullet points and then from there, then I will try to, uh, you know, like talk about the bullet points, little bit, like explanation, something like that. Uh, it, it helps me to, to, um, Uh, a little bit faster. And if you see like my block style, most of them always have like the bullet points.

Dan:

Okay.

Bekah:

Well, I think that's great for readers do.

Dan:

I think it's a really effective way to, to write. Absolutely. Um, that's how I, that's how I usually write the, when I blog once a year. Um, I did the same thing, uh, as opposed to once a week. Um, yeah, for me it's once a year maybe, but, uh, I, I, I've just, I'm impressed, especially on a limited time schedule. Like you have, um, that you have both the. I don't know the dedication, the willpower, you know, to, to, to do the blogging because it's, I it's optional. Right. Nobody's making you do it, or it's not like part of any of your, I don't know, certifications or anything like that. Right. And so you're, you're, um, you're just doing it on your own and it's impressive. Like blogging is one of those things where I'm always like, yes, this month I'm going to get into the habit, you know? And it never happens because it's, nobody's making, you know, you know, nobody's asking me to write on my own on my own website. So. I'm always impressed by people who can.

Ayu:

the, it's actually one of the things that get me into learning to code as well, because, uh, besides that I want to, um, uh, have my, uh, photos showcase. I also want to. Wanted to write about my experience, like living, living in another country and with a toddler and stuffs. Um, but I finally didn't write anything until thank you for DC for having that a monthly challenge of November, where we have to write. Right. And it's actually, that's one of the things that can. Hmm. Uh, how do you say, uh, uh, how do you say that accountable? Make me accountable. Hold me accountable. Yeah. Yeah. It's uh, when we do something together, right. And then like, yeah, everybody's like, oh, I already wrote this and I wrote this and I was like, oh yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm going to do that. You know, like it's, it's fun and yeah. Even after the, the monthly challenge, then I was still like in my, uh, you know, I was like in my mood to, to, to write. And that's why I keep writing, but it's

Dan:

That's awesome.

Ayu:

all PC.

Dan:

from VC

Bekah:

As in November, we ran our first monthly challenge and that was, um, November is NaNoWriMo. So national novel writing month. And the goal is to write 50,000 words, which is about the size of a novel. And so we said, Hey, why don't we all work together and try and pick, get hit 50,000 words this month writing and adding to our blogs.

Dan:

Like collectively,

Bekah:

Yes, not individually.

Dan:

right.

Bekah:

Um, and it turned out to be a lot of fun. It was kind of a last minute thing. And a lot of people participated. A lot of people were writing for the first time and we didn't hit 50,000, but I think, you know, we didn't really gear up either. It was like, okay, we're going to do this. But I really think this November we could hit 50,000 words and it'll be a lot of fun. It was great to see everybody sharing and asking for feedback and, and getting like new and exciting ideas out there. Um, But I also want to bring up, so you're writing across platforms and not only that, but you're like recognized on all of the platforms that you're writing on. Like you're consistently one of the top bloggers in, um, you were recognized, well, why don't you talk about that first or get ahead of myself. I'm so excited about it. Um, Writing on all of these different platforms and your choice to do that. And you know, how, how are I want to say that? I don't think you give yourself enough credit, right? Because everybody is giving you credit here and saying like, I, you is an amazing writer and all these ways. And.

Ayu:

No. I mean, like I w I write, because I want to write, right. It was, it was only for the sake of the monthly challenge at the beginning. And I don't have any, you know, like a website or something like that. So I started with a platform of hashed note where I can have my own, um, Uh, address, but, uh, I can use their platform. And then from there I cross posted two deaths and then, uh, and then there's a code newbie, and then I cross posit as well to go newbie. I never think about like gaming. Defending readers or something like that, because I thought, I even thought that no one will ever read my blog and I write, I write the blog posts purely only for myself, you know? Like I want to have my notes out there because my notes are so cluttering and, uh, I want to, uh, look back to it and yeah. I would write for myself that that was the first thing. So I didn't even know like, like when you say back, I like, oh, how do you do that? I have no idea. I mean, like, I never even thought that one with read, so

Bekah:

Well, everyone is reading. And also you were one of the code newbie spotlights in April. Yeah. April. You were a code newbie. Spotlight. Talk a little bit about that. Cause that's awesome.

Ayu:

Yeah. I mean, like, it was a nice surprise. Um, Code Newbie, like sent me a DM on Twitter and Hey, do you want to be our April spotlight? And I was like, oh yeah, sure. Like, how come

Dan:

Yeah.

Ayu:

I have no idea? Like, it's, it's a big surprise and yeah. So that

Bekah:

Yeah.

Ayu:

was pretty much about it. I mean, like, I, I didn't see that it's coming, you know,

Bekah:

I mean, I just love that. I love the picture of you and your mom in, in that spotlight. It's just such a beautiful way to kind of end that there. And, know, I don't, I don't know if you want to say anything about your mom, but I know that she was a big

Ayu:

Yeah, Yeah, yeah, It's, it's actually, it's actually. Um, kind of, kind of nice story. I think like, uh, my mom, we were, we were really like best friend. I mean, like we were really close and, um, she suddenly got, uh, diagnosed with auto-immune. Um, it's actually pretty much, uh, maintainable, if you have like a good medicine, right. And one of it is like steroids, but at that time in, in, uh, where, uh, where she lived, uh that's, there's not enough staff. So she got worse and worse and worse, like really fast. So, uh, like one day, and she didn't want to receive my call for like a couple of weeks, because she was like, so in so bad, bad condition and she didn't want to say anything, but one time, like finally she received my phone call and then. I told her, like, we talk a lot with, we talk almost two hours so that they, um, uh, I told her like, Hey, I want to, uh, participate in this, uh, photography, um, you know, photography challenge. And if I won, I said, uh, then, then I would be like, in this magazine in Germany. Yeah. And they, they would pick up like 20, 20 pictures and the top winner would be like, uh, going into the magazine in Germany and just like, oh, you should make me as your model. You know? And I think that you would win with my, with my foot on it. And I really want to see you on the magazine. I was like, yeah. All right. I didn't even get into the, the talent of the photography. And, uh, like not long after that, it's like the week or two weeks, something like that. Then, um, I got a phone call from my arm, uh, and she said like, I think that he should go. All of you are like me and my siblings. You all should go back because like, she's getting worse. And we're like, oh, okay. So we flew, right. We flew there. And after I was there, five days late, later she passed away. So I didn't, I didn't get into a day magazine of course, because I didn't, I didn't, uh, Participate in, in the photography challenge and with this called newbie. And suddenly now, after, after the, uh, my profile got into prose work called Nubian, then I remember this, you know, like this conversation, like when she said, I want to see you on that magazine and this time. It's not the magazine, but I mean, like I want an article and that's me, that's me there. And that's why I took my mom picture there because like, Hey, mom is like, you're there now? You know, like it's not, it's not on the photography thing that we talk about, but there on, on my, uh, on an article about me. So yeah, I hope that.

Bekah:

It's such a beautiful story and it's so nice to hear you share it and to talk about your mom and, and, and that support and to see how it just all kind of come around and, you know, um, yeah. I just, just really, really beautiful.

Ayu:

Yeah. I just hope that she proud of

Dan:

Okay.

Ayu:

I mean, like, Yeah.

Bekah:

Okay. I mean, are you, you're doing so much. I mean, you're taking care of your daughter, you're learning, you're bringing up, helping so much with the community and being such a, a great person to have in our community and to, you know, have your support and all of the things that you share. And, you know, you've, you've touched so many lives. So I feel like she, most definitely is proud of that.

Ayu:

Thank you. Thank you so much. And I'm, I'm, I'm very, very grateful to find, uh, fertile coffee, to be honest, and like, thank you back that Dan and Kirk and Sara and yeah, everybody in VC, like very, very supportive and very, very loving. I mean, like this is the first time that I feel like I'm not alone, not only in the journey of learning, but VC is more like a family to me. And even though we haven't met in real life, but I feel like I'm so close to everyone as if like, yeah, I, I I've met you all for a thousand years, so yeah.

Bekah:

Yeah. I mean, that's been my experience too. You know, I always struggled with finding friends and fitting in and kind of understanding like my place in things. And it's just been really nice to be able to share that with other people and for other people too, except except me where I'm at in that. Place and, and to be able to talk about things more openly, because I don't know if, if he knew me five years ago, I'm a much different person than I was. And before I never would have shared any of that, I just would've like bottled it all up, but it's nice to have a community that you feel safe and supported with and to be able to talk about those things like, wow, I'm just really, really having a tough day today. You know, and, and just to even just somebody giving me a heart emoji is like, sometimes that's all I need. I just need someone to acknowledge that I am having a hard day. Um, and it's, and it's just a really special place. I haven't found anything else like that.

Ayu:

True. True. I feel, I feel the same. I mean, like when was I find Virtual coffee, it was from your tweet, right, Bekah?. Hey, I'm having this, uh, Virtual coffee and, uh, you, uh, you post the slack, the slack link, and I did join the slack, but I wasn't saying anything at all. And I was like, I don't know. I mean, like I'm still learning. All people here already developer, you know, and I got, how can I, I, I didn't even dare to say hi. I was like, oh my God, who am I? You know? But yeah. So I finally, after, I don't know, a couple of months I seen and finally. I say hi and introduce myself, uh, in the slack. And then I went to the meeting for the first time when I was like, no, everybody's like so nice. And everybody's like, maybe already have more than 10 years experience, but they're still like so humble and so caring. And I was like, yes, I think I know that I'm in the right. In a heartbeat. I just know that, yeah, this is, this is my community, you know? Right. Nice. It's always nice to be in VC like you can see me almost every day on slack. Oh, sorry for that. come up. Help it.

Dan:

Oh, we are certainly glad you are here. Um, in slack and, and at the meetings. Uh it's it's I don't know. It's always good to see you there

Ayu:

Oh, oh one time. Like, uh, I usually like do co-work at nights, right? Because I've learned at night and most of the time. I cannot really talk because my husband and my thing, my daughter's super sensitive to voices. But the, for today I already told my husband, like, don't get bothered because I'm going to talk loud. And yeah. So usually in the coworking channel, like people don't really hear my voice because I always typing, like people say something that has weight, right. And then one time Glenn. I will give ten bucks to anybody who can make her talk because I never hear her voice.

Dan:

That's amazing.

Bekah:

That is so funny.

Ayu:

Yeah.

Dan:

Now we can just send him this podcast episode, Right.

Bekah:

That's right. Who gets a 10 bucks.

Dan:

Oh, yeah. Who gets it? That we'll split it.

Bekah:

Okay.

Ayu:

it.

Bekah:

I guess you've given a lot of advice throughout this podcast and through all the blogs that you've written. So I have, I guess, two more questions for you. And the first would be what has been your favorite blog post to write if you have one and then the second question would be, if you had advice to give to somebody in your shoes, what would that advice.

Ayu:

My favorite. My favorite post so far is the last one to be honest system, massive burnout ones that when I, uh, that's the fastest one that I, that I wrote because it's really coming, coming from, like, I don't, I don't really filter it. It's just coming out and yeah, that will one is my favorite blog posts. And if I have. Uh, oh, what, what did you say again?

Bekah:

If you had one piece of advice to give to someone in your shoes, what would it be?

Ayu:

well, if you, if you're a, self-learner like try to. Find a community because it's, it really, really helps you. I mean, like it's, uh, it helps me a lot. Uh, I get more confident and, and I have people to support me. And when, when I can, I also, I also can support someone. Right. And it makes you feel like you're not alone, but also fell you bowl or somebody else. And if you want to start your own. Don't think twice, just, just write it and don't think that maybe nobody will really read it or maybe it's not good. No, it is just write it. I mean like it's, uh, you write it for yourself. That's, that's the first thing that you only have to think, like write it for yourself and then the rest will come.

Bekah:

Yeah, that's so great. Well, I thank you so much for being here with us today on the podcast, but for being such a great part of the community, it's been so wonderful to have you here with us.

Dan:

thank you

Bekah:

Thank you for listening to this episode of the Virtual Coffee Podcast. This episode was produced by Dan Ott and Bekah Hawrot Weigel and edited by Dan Ott. If you have questions or comments, you can hit us up on Twitter at VirtualCoffeeIO, or you can email us at podcast@virtualcoffee.io. You can find the show notes, plus you can sign up for our newsletter to find out what Virtual Coffee's been up to on our website at virtualcoffee.io.

Dan:

Please subscribe to our podcast and be sure to leave us a review. Thanks for listening. And we'll see you next week.


The Virtual Coffee Podcast is produced by Dan Ott and Bekah Hawrot Weigel and edited by Dan Ott.